It's been a while, thought I would update

So, I have not really been here since October. Hubby was laid off; I have been working 2 and 3 jobs, so been busy. But, I had some time so I thought I would check in and update you all. I hope you all needed a new book to read, LOL…I still have Java my Senegal parrot, who is the love of my life (besides my hubby and kids, LOL). We still do everything together, go everywhere but bed together, and the only reason she has a cage is so that she is safe when I am sleeping. I still have not cut her wings since I bought her last April and so she is starting to like flying a bit. I used to take her out on the porch while waiting for bus for son, but one day she decided to fly and flew over a big bush onto my lawn. I live on a very main busy road with many many cars and trucks, and if she just changed the direction of her flight, she would have landed in the road. Hence, she does not get to come outside any more, which makes me feel bad. I am thinking I need to clip her wings, but I am fighting myself, because I want her to be able to fly. I am afraid of her getting hurt, or flying out the door, or flying and hitting something hard and dying. She still hates all other people and animals. She is my baby and she is so spoiled it is not funny. About 3 months ago, I saw an ad on a pet free cycle type board, but where they sell animals. She was advertising 3 Sun Conures/Jenday that she had to sell because she was moving. I sent an e-mail asking some questions and we chatted by e-mail a few times, and she eventually told me she had gotten rid of 2 of the 3, that her brother was taking the 2 parents. She claims that the bird I have was bred from the 2 she gave her brother. I paid 200 for him, with his cage (too too small and I need to get him a new one) and toys. I bought him for one reason thinking the kids could handle him, as I am feeling bad that they cannot handle Java the Sennie. I asked a bunch of questions that in hindsight, I realized she never answered, and she just gave very vague answers. I asked her his age numerous times and she never told me. I am assuming he is young because of the feathers in his head that some seem to still have that shaft on them. I got him home and kept him away from Java until at least a month was over. HE IS HORRENDOUSLY LOUD, but so far I can handle it. I am in the same room with him now inches from where his cage is and he screams at me from inches away. First day I had him, he talked. He talks quite a bit. The things I hear clearly are, with any movement, hubby coming home from work, kids coming from school, mailman, dog barking, he says “who is it” or “who is it birdie” and he says “Silly birdie.” The lady I bought him from thought he was a boy, but had no proof. I had him DNA’d and he is a boy. He steps up perfect from his cage, as long as I touch the perch i want him to get on to step up from and do not try to get him to step up from the back of the cage. I have had him 3 months and have not gotten bitten yet. He does, however, scare the begeezers out of me. He will not do anything when out but run, literally run to my shoulder. He does not play with anything. If I put my finger to my shoulder to get him off of it and say step up, he screeches really loud and touches my finger with his beak. The first few times this scared the heck out of me, but now, I just say no, and keep my finger there, and he steps up. I don’t get why he is doing this. I admit; his screech scares me more than the fake-bite does. I thought he was maybe hit, cause he seems hand shy, like if I pet his head, and will screech many a times, unless he sees my hand clearly coming to pet his head, but then I figured the vocabulary he is saying would be different if they were abusing him or yelling at him. I cannot handle him nearly as much as my Sennie, and that disappoints me. I have not yet bonded with him, as I did instantly with Sennie. All he does is scream from his cage if he is not out of it, and if he is out of it, he does nothing but sit on my shoulder. He also does this thing where he hangs from the side of his cage by his beak, no hands, and makes a chirping monkey like sound while fluttering his wings like a butterfly. I think it is a mating call of some sort. He is constantly humping my shoulders, my computer mouse, his hidey hole in his cage, anything. Now, some other side notes. Sennie HATES HIM. Since the day I let them see each other, she has hated him. In the very beginning, she would chase after him and pull his tail feathers. I learned this behavior, and do not allow it any longer, but I cannot leave them alone, unsupervised, out for even 1 second. The kids are afraid of him, and once I put him on my son’s shoulder, and he took a bite at my son, so now I am afraid to let them touch him. While they are both out, they can sit on opposite shoulders and are usually fine, although Java is a sneak and is always trying to get to the Conure. I have no doubt she would peck him to death if given the chance. He is petrified of her. He sees her coming, he cowers. I think this is why he is stuck to my shoulders. If I make her go in her cage and give him some free me time, he explores slightly more than he does when she is out, but he does not play at all like my Sennie does. He screeches whenever I touch him places that are not his head. I forget who I have sometimes and go to hug him on my shoulder like I do to my Sennie, and he screeches and scares the heck out of me. So, I hope that is enough info, now on to some questions!!! 1. Do you think the Sennie and the Conure will ever get along? If so, do you have any ideas on how to lessen that time frame? I don’t want them to be best buddies, but I want Java to stop trying to kill the Conure and I want the Conure to not be so scared and to grow a pair, LOL. He is much bigger than her, and he cowers at her. 2. Why is the Conure barking before her bite so much? The screeching scares me to death. I am NEVER scared with my Sennie, not even 1 single day since I have had her. I am the Sennie’s only owner, so I assume she has no past owner baggage, and I know I have to work to gain the Conure’s trust, but would he not see how I tread the Sennie and see I am not hurting her? 3. Why is he screaming when I am inches from him in his cage? I gather he wants out, as Sennie is always out, unless I punish her for being bad and chasing the Conure, and I put her in her cage for a time out. 4. OMG, not a question but an observation. THE CONURE POOPS SO MUCH. I feel like a tree. He backs up to poop so it winds up on the back of my shirt which I cannot see. I change my shirt 3-4 times a day. I cannot stand this part of him, honestly. The Sennie, she is mainly off me when she poops and only poops half as much as the Conure does. I really am thinking of trying some birdie diapers for him. To be honest, I already have a taker if I was to want to rehome the Conure, but I am trying to be patient and give him the time he needs to be comfortable with me and to maybe allow myself to not be so afraid of his screeches, but I am very disappointed in the Conure as a breed. The lady told me he was very friendly and loved all people, etc., but when I would ask specifics she would no answer me. In hindsight, I probably should not have bought him with the little information she gave me. Awe, and then when it is quiet and Java is sleeping, he goes and kisses me (feel like a kiss, but I know it is not) on the cheek and he is a cutie pie. So, any thoughts, and please don’t beat me up. And lastly, here is Petey the Jenday Conure.

http://img703.imageshack.us/i/dsc02235z.jpg/

Hi and welcome back!I about died laughing reading your post. That’s a sun conure for you. There’s a lot of screaming and screeching grumbling/barking/complaining. If you stay scared, he might start biting you. He sounds a little spoiled with the running to the shoulder and the screaming when you’re just inches away. Here’s what you might try for the running up to the shoulders:http://staringatbirdsandgoats.blogspot. … ilege.htmlThe screaming, I’m not sure if you’ve described a screaming problem. If he’s a non-stop screamer, like for hours on end, that’s going to take many months to rehab. If he’s just screaming when he’s a few inches away from you or when you put him in his cage, that’s pretty easily rehabbed.http://staringatbirdsandgoats.blogspot. … educe.htmlhttp://staringatbirdsandgoats.blogspot. … -jail.htmlAlso, try foraging toys for the screaming. Get the bird foraging and you can try to make it so he only ever eats when he’s foraging. A foraging, eating bird can’t scream. Suns are big time destroyers so lots of wood toys. Teach him to talk for attention. When he talks or makes other acceptable cute noises, baby talk to him or pick him up or play with him. When he’s screaming, leave the room. The grumbling/complaining/barking and touching you with his beak that scares you when you touch him - not much you can do about that. Get it through your mind that that’s what he is and it doesn’t mean anything. They’re little terriers (terrors). I don’t know if you’re familiar with jack russell terriers. If you are, see it as you just got a mature jack russell terrier.My husband told me to add - The grumbling/complaining/barking, imagine asking a man to get up off the couch on a Sunday to take out the trash. He’ll do it, but you’ll get a lot of grumbling and complaining.

Ha, ha! I meant jenday.BTW - you can potty train him. Since he’s mature, it should take you all of a couple of hours to teach him the potty command/poop connection. It will take him a few weeks/months to make the connection not to poop on you.http://staringatbirdsandgoats.blogspot. … mmand.html

patdbunny wrote:Hi and welcome back!I about died laughing reading your post. That’s a sun conure for you. There’s a lot of screaming and screeching grumbling/barking/complaining. If you stay scared, he might start biting you. He sounds a little spoiled with the running to the shoulder and the screaming when you’re just inches away. Here’s what you might try for the running up to the shoulders:http://staringatbirdsandgoats.blogspot. … ilege.htmlThe screaming, I’m not sure if you’ve described a screaming problem. If he’s a non-stop screamer, like for hours on end, that’s going to take many months to rehab. If he’s just screaming when he’s a few inches away from you or when you put him in his cage, that’s pretty easily rehabbed.http://staringatbirdsandgoats.blogspot. … educe.htmlhttp://staringatbirdsandgoats.blogspot. … -jail.htmlAlso, try foraging toys for the screaming. Get the bird foraging and you can try to make it so he only ever eats when he’s foraging. A foraging, eating bird can’t scream. Suns are big time destroyers so lots of wood toys. Teach him to talk for attention. When he talks or makes other acceptable cute noises, baby talk to him or pick him up or play with him. When he’s screaming, leave the room. The grumbling/complaining/barking and touching you with his beak that scares you when you touch him - not much you can do about that. Get it through your mind that that’s what he is and it doesn’t mean anything. They’re little terriers (terrors). I don’t know if you’re familiar with jack russell terriers. If you are, see it as you just got a mature jack russell terrier.My husband told me to add - The grumbling/complaining/barking, imagine asking a man to get up off the couch on a Sunday to take out the trash. He’ll do it, but you’ll get a lot of grumbling and complaining.Patdbunny, I literally spent hours reading your blog before I posted this morning. I love your blog. When I go to bed, I cover his cage and he is quiet until one of the kids comes in the room. See, I work nights so my birds sleep days with me. He is quiet while I am sleeping usualy and does not start screaming until the kids come home from school, which is perfect. The screaming he does inches away is not the usual screaming he does. It is more of a chirp monkey thing, or he hangs on the side of the cage and talks to me. I usually take him out right away because the family is sleeping, so i have probably reinforced his screaming. I do not put him away because he is screaming. The only reason I put him away is to allow me to work (not having to watch the 2 of them like a hawk) and when it is time to change my shirt because of all the poop on my back. I try to leave his cage open so he can come and go, but Java the Sennie goes in his cage and he just hides in the corner. I have to buy forraging toys very badly. Sennie is not like him. Sennie does not play with toys really, she plays with me. The toys in her cage sit untouched. The conure does chew and play so he wouuld probably love some forraging toys. I hate spending that much money that the stores want for them, so I have to get creative and make my own. That’s exactly what his screaming is like, when you ask the hubby to take out the trash on Sundays, it scares me to death. I am working on it not scaring me so much. No matter what you read online, cause I did do alot of reading before I bought him, you have no idea what it all means until you have one.

patdbunny wrote:Ha, ha! I meant jenday.BTW - you can potty train him. Since he’s mature, it should take you all of a couple of hours to teach him the potty command/poop connection. It will take him a few weeks/months to make the connection not to poop on you.http://staringatbirdsandgoats.blogspot. … mmand.htmlWill give this a try and see what happens. I ask him after he poops, did you poop, and he just looks at me.

Cheap foraging toys - paper egg cartons, coffee filters, hubby’s old tube socks (laundered in bleach), paper cups, ring shaped pellets/cherrios hung on shoe laces, empty cereal boxes, empty tissue boxes. That’s all I can think of right now this minute.Great info: http://www.parrotenrichment.com/Other noise reducing ideas - Give him a bath. Usually after a bath they’re really calm.Ducky likes to swing on a dog leash hanging off a sun visor when he’s in the car. He doesn’t like to swing himself because I hung up a leash in his cage, but he doesn’t swing there. He likes when I hold a leash or some rope thing and swing him. You can try gently swinging the conure and see if he likes that. If he does you can accelerate the swinging so he’s flapping around and getting his energy out. Generally, they can’t hold on swinging and scream at the same time. Play fetch w/ a jingle cat ball or other favorite toy.I’ll let you know if I think of anything else.What time do you sleep during the day? The shift in sleep time can be really hard for the birdies, especially the gumbly little jendays. Do you think he might be quiet while you sleep, but keep him uncovered and give him lotsa toys and foraging items and fresh foods (try half apples, half oranges, large chunks of food that he has to destroy). For this I’d try giving him a good 15-20 minute attention/cuddle session first, then put him in the cage with all this good stuff, tell him “sshhh. nite, nite”, you go to bed and see what happens. Pretend to sleep for 10 -15 minutes, if he doesn’t quiet down during that time, don’t open your eyes or move just give him a little “shhh”; wait 5 minutes, if he doesn’t quiet down give him another little “shhh”, count to 10, if he doesn’t quiet down, you quietly get up and cover him with no drama, then you go to bed like you normally do. Repeat this over a few days and I think you can train him to be quiet uncovered while you sleep.

http://www.parrotenrichment.com/

Hi, Pat gave you wonderful advice overall, but I wanted to add one thing that she did not mention.You said you took your flighted sennie outside? That is a really really bad idea… and everyone would agree that you don’t do that again please!Get a harness for your bird, there is one really good brand called, Aviator Harness.http://theparrotuniversity.com/aviator_harness.phpAnother thing, please don’t think that clipping will prevent your bird from getting lost. With the right amount of wind blowing in the right direction, your bird can fly away very very far even with clipped wings.The harness is the ONLY safe way to take your bird outside without a carrier.

patdbunny wrote:Cheap foraging toys - paper egg cartons, coffee filters, hubby’s old tube socks (laundered in bleach), paper cups, ring shaped pellets/cherrios hung on shoe laces, empty cereal boxes, empty tissue boxes. That’s all I can think of right now this minute.Great info: http://www.parrotenrichment.com/Other noise reducing ideas - Give him a bath. Usually after a bath they’re really calm.Ducky likes to swing on a dog leash hanging off a sun visor when he’s in the car. He doesn’t like to swing himself because I hung up a leash in his cage, but he doesn’t swing there. He likes when I hold a leash or some rope thing and swing him. You can try gently swinging the conure and see if he likes that. If he does you can accelerate the swinging so he’s flapping around and getting his energy out. Generally, they can’t hold on swinging and scream at the same time. Play fetch w/ a jingle cat ball or other favorite toy.I’ll let you know if I think of anything else.What time do you sleep during the day? The shift in sleep time can be really hard for the birdies, especially the gumbly little jendays. Do you think he might be quiet while you sleep, but keep him uncovered and give him lotsa toys and foraging items and fresh foods (try half apples, half oranges, large chunks of food that he has to destroy). For this I’d try giving him a good 15-20 minute attention/cuddle session first, then put him in the cage with all this good stuff, tell him “sshhh. nite, nite”, you go to bed and see what happens. Pretend to sleep for 10 -15 minutes, if he doesn’t quiet down during that time, don’t open your eyes or move just give him a little “shhh”; wait 5 minutes, if he doesn’t quiet down give him another little “shhh”, count to 10, if he doesn’t quiet down, you quietly get up and cover him with no drama, then you go to bed like you normally do. Repeat this over a few days and I think you can train him to be quiet uncovered while you sleep.There are some really neat toy idea on that link, love the stuff there. I wish I had an ounce of creatitivity in my body. I tried once with Sennie. Took a toilet paper roll, put birdie food in it, wraped it in paper and tied off the ends with string, and sennie could not get into it. I admit, I have not tried to go to bed w/o covering the Conure. I cover my Sennie, and have done so since I have her, and she is on my schedule, and has been, but I figured cover the Conure too or he will keep the Sennie up. I am upstairs, they are downstairs when I go to bed. I can try leaving them both uncovered and see what happens, with plenty of toys, foods, what not. If I close my door, I probably won’t hear them screaming, if they scream. That just seems to not make sense cause they will be sleepy all night while I am awake to play with them. I work nights from around 10 p.m. till at least 7 am, when I get kids off to school, but usually come back and work till about 10 a.m. and then go to bed around 11 a.m. It just has worked, since nobody is home during day with me, that Sennie would slep while I slept, so she got into the habit with me, and now Conure too has been doing this with me for the 3 months I have him. I tell them both “go nigth night” and “ah ah ah baby” like in song. Jave knows what that means, and I start saying it about 20 minutes or so before I am ready to go to bed. Conure does not seem grumpy to me, just wants to do what he wants, when he wants, and if I make him do something he does not want to do, he has no problem letting me know about it. You should see when I change his water. He loves it. He stands there making all these noises while I am getting fresh water, and then when I put it in his cage, he literally jumps in it. It is the cutest thing. He definitely is a work in process. Oh, and they each come takes showers with me every day. Sometimes, I just let them watch me. Other times, I make them get wet. Those days, they are quiet for at least an hour afterwards, so you’re right about giving him a bath quieting him. Thank you so much for all your suggestions, they are all fabulous.

http://www.parrotenrichment.com/

GlassOnion wrote:Hi, Pat gave you wonderful advice overall, but I wanted to add one thing that she did not mention.You said you took your flighted sennie outside? That is a really really bad idea… and everyone would agree that you don’t do that again please!Get a harness for your bird, there is one really good brand called, Aviator Harness.http://theparrotuniversity.com/aviator_harness.phpAnother thing, please don’t think that clipping will prevent your bird from getting lost. With the right amount of wind blowing in the right direction, your bird can fly away very very far even with clipped wings.The harness is the ONLY safe way to take your bird outside without a carrier.Yes, when I first got her, well when school started back, I would take her out on the porch and we would sit and wait for the bus. She never even tried to fly, but as her wings grow in, she is getting more and more adventurous, so now I cannot even attempt to take her outside. She has realized (and I know you all love to leave them flighted) that she can now fly. Before, she knew she could not, even if she tried, and would just fall to the floor. Her wings, even if nobody wants to admit it, and believe me I am fighting the thought in my head, make her more willing to try something that could get her in trouble. There is a huge noticeable difference in her from before her wings grew in to now when her wings are grown in pretty much all the way. It is like she all the sudden has super powers, and her attitude has changed to thinking she is the queen. I put her somewhere (usually so I can do something with the Conure) and she just flies back. I am not joking 1 little bit. I have not done it yet, still thinking about it. I know being wingless will not prevent every single thing from happening, but I do feel, in general, since I had her when she was clipped, that clipping her would help with some things. Like, if I put her somewhere so I can do something with the Conure or with one of my real children, she might stay where I put her. I uusally copy my posts over to Microsoft word to spell check them, because this print is so tiny and I cannot really see it, but I didn’t on this one or the last one, so please ignore spellign errors. I cannot also find my glasses at the moment. I should check the Conure’s hidey hole, LOL.

I ask him after he poops, did you poop, and he just looks at me.There’s no connection there to “go poop” when you ask afterwards. You have kids, it’s like potty training a child. Asking a child “did you go poop” afterwards, doesn’t make a connection to ask to go to the bathroom before pooping happens. You ask a child beforehand, when you think the child might need to go poop, “do you need to go potty?” And the child eventually makes the connection, "yeah, I need to go poop."My prior jenday when I’d tell her, “go potty”, she got to the point she’d at least wiggle her butt and try to go poop. If she did that, even though nothing came out, I knew she was good on my shoulder for the next 15-20 minutes.